Forum Transcripts

Open Question Night: Agents, publishing, paraphrased thought 3/31/06

Event start time:

Fri Mar 31 19:05:31 2006

Event end time:

Fri Mar 31 20:31:01 2006



Legend:
Questions from the Audience are presented in red.
Answers by the Speaker are in black.
The Moderator's comments are in blue.

mary rosenblum

Hello all.

mary rosenblum

Welcome to our Friday Forum

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

I thought I'd do an open question night to give anyone who has a question...

mary rosenblum

that hasn't come up in one of our recent forums...to ask it!

sallyk

Would you mind going over queries again? The vital elements...

mary rosenblum

Sure, sally...what kind of query? To a NF magazine editor? An agent or book publisher?

sallyk

Yes, I'm thinking non-fiction magazines

mary rosenblum

Those are important, sally, and really worth practicing because that is where you either sell your idea or fail to sell it.

mary rosenblum

Most pros don't even write the article until they get a 'yes' back from the editor.

mary rosenblum

Essentially you are trying to sell your idea for a cool article.

mary rosenblum

So you need a strong 'hook' to catch the editor's attention as she skims through the stack of queries on her desk...

mary rosenblum

and then you need to let her know why her readers want it, and why YOU are the person to write it.

mary rosenblum

Generally, a strong hook for your article will also work as the first line of your query letter.

mary rosenblum

The 'why your readers want it' comes from analyzing the magazine.

mary rosenblum

Before you query, you should know who reads it and what issues they seem to be interested in.

mary rosenblum

The 'why you should write it', is generally that a: you are an expert, b: you have interviewed experts.

mary rosenblum

Editors rarely rarely buy articles without some original source material.

mary rosenblum

That means comments from an expert, usually...

mary rosenblum

expert meaning someone who has a direct connection to the topic you're addressing.

mary rosenblum

If I write an article about writing, I can be the expert. :-)

mary rosenblum

If I write an article about lilac varieties, I'll need comments from a well known lilac breeder.

geezer

You use "she" a lot when speaking of editors. Are editors predominately female?

mary rosenblum

I don't really know if they predominate or not, geeze. I don't think so. I just consciously balance genders....we have no neuter third person pronoun except it...

mary rosenblum

and he/she is klunky...so I just mix he and she in examples.

foxx

I've heard titles, receipes, jokes arn't copyrighted. True? If so are there more?

mary rosenblum

Titles aren't copyrighted, foxx.

mary rosenblum

I believe receipes are, and I'm sure jokes are...but you can check on the US copyright webpage to be sure.

mary rosenblum

copyright webpage

janecj333

We're writers. We should come up with a neutral pronoun.

mary rosenblum

Oh, it was tried...back in the late eighties, I believe? Big push for yeye meaning he/she...didn't catch on.

mary rosenblum

And by the way, all images on the internet are copyrighted.

geezer

"himer"

mary rosenblum

I like that one better.

mary rosenblum

Ideas are not copyrighted either, by the way.

mary rosenblum

But it is a very common myth that the idea sells the story...that it is all that matters.

mary rosenblum

And that's totally false.

janecj333

How about 'nee'? It was good enough for MOnty Python, after all.

mary rosenblum

That's good too. Now we just have to get people to use it.

mary rosenblum

A lot of new writers are very discouraged because they don't feel that they can come up with something 'really new'.

mary rosenblum

And that really doesn't matter.

mary rosenblum

Everything has been done.

mary rosenblum

It's what YOU do with these characters, this situation, this place that makes your story work...or not.

mary rosenblum

A very nice workshop exercise I use is to give all the participants the same story idea...

mary rosenblum

the resultant stories are widely different.

mary rosenblum

It's just that when you're first writing, you can't see the subtle reasons why THIS story is so powerful and THAT story is not...

mary rosenblum

so it seems that it must be something like idea. But it's not that simple at all.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

I do have a question from roe on paraphrasing.

mary rosenblum

This is when you paraphrase what a character is thinking rather than trying to 'quote' that character's actual thoughts.

mary rosenblum

After shoveling out the drive, Liz felt exhausted. Almost had a mind to turn around and go back in the house and crawl back into bed. But she had a lot to do today. The wedding flowers needed to be packed up and ready for the church. The ones for the hall had to be delivered today, not that she looked forward to going anywhere in this weather. Poor Emma. Liz hoped tomorrow faired better. The snow was bad enough but the blowing made it darn near impossible to see. She heard on the radio that schools were closed. They said if you didn't have to go out not to. Maybe she should have stayed home. At least until it stopped later this morning. Oh well too late now. Besides,she had too much to do to stay home.

mary rosenblum

This is a narrative that gives us the gist of what Liz is thinking and it's very well done.

mary rosenblum

We get sentence fragments and turns of phrase that suggest this is her voice, so the reader 'hears' it as her thought.

mary rosenblum

It tends to be less noticeable to the reader than trying to create 'actual' thoughts. If you pay attention to how you think...

mary rosenblum

you'll realize that it's rarely in grammatically correct sentences, but often in fragments, images, single words...

mary rosenblum

which don't translate well to the page. But the grammatical sentences sound utterly phony because we all know we don't think like that all the time.

mary rosenblum

If she did all this with 'I' as if Liz was talking to herself it would sound clunky.

mary rosenblum

.This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

janecj333

That explanation, that the idea is not key, is the crux of my suspicion toward queries being successful: they contain no part of the story that the author is hoping to sell. Who can tell from a query if a writer is merely competent or extraordinary?

mary rosenblum

Jane there's no way an agent or editor can tell if the book is any good or not, unless the query is really poorly written.

mary rosenblum

Then it's an instant fail.

mary rosenblum

That's not the purpose of the query.

mary rosenblum

Agents and editors use it to triage the many many dozens of totally inappropriate submissions they get every day.

mary rosenblum

Many people write 'the great Americain novel' and simply start trying every agent or publisher on whatever list they can find...

mary rosenblum

paying no attention to what that publisher publishes or that agent handles. I kid you not.

mary rosenblum

So when the publisher who ONLY publishes nonfiction gets the mystery novel query, it's less hassle to say no than if he had five pounds of paper on his desk...multiply that by 100.

mary rosenblum

Since computers and printers came on the scene, submissions to publishers/agents has skyrocketed...

mary rosenblum

and most of those are awful.

mary rosenblum

This query barrier and the agent only barrier went up because of that. Alas.

mary rosenblum

If you're offering something that the publisher publishers or the agents handle, usually they'll ask for a synopsis and three chapters.

mary rosenblum

And...

mary rosenblum

a little note. A lot of 'agents' most of whom are not located in New York...

mary rosenblum

have a cute little business going, where they charge clients and dutifully submit their novels...

mary rosenblum

and they do just that...start with A and head for Z and the naive writer pays as that ms...

mary rosenblum

is sent to publishers who don't even publish that type of work.

mary rosenblum

And the publishers know who these agents are.

mary rosenblum

Needless to say the publishers don't bother to open the packages, most of the time...

mary rosenblum

and needless to say, the 'agents' are not members of AAR.

mary rosenblum

Always know whom your agent is submitting to and do a little checking yourself.

geezer

Do you mean there is a fee for each submission?

mary rosenblum

These are not real agents, geeze.

mary rosenblum

They're scams. They might even sell a book or two when they run across something saleable...

mary rosenblum

but they mostly make their money in fees, yes.

mary rosenblum

Legitimate agents get 15% of everything you make on whatever they sell...

mary rosenblum

and they don't get a dime until you DO sell.

mary rosenblum

Now can you guess why agents are leary of new writers? :-)

mary rosenblum

They don't get paid for your work until they sell it. So they're very picky.

mary rosenblum

That's why a 'yes' from an agent is not a guaranteed sale, but it's a darn good bet it's going to sell.

foxx

Who's AAR?

mary rosenblum

Association of Authors' Representative

mary rosenblum

That's the professional organization of agents.

mary rosenblum

They had a stiff code of ethics, and a wonderful FAQ page that will educate you in how to acquire an agent...

mary rosenblum

what questions to ask, and what to be careful of.

mary rosenblum

AAR homepage

janecj333

I wish that were all so, Mary. Of 50 or so agents I have queried (two novel manuscripts) who accept science fiction or commercial fiction,, one has asked for synopsis and sample chapters.

mary rosenblum

Well,what can I tell you, Jane? What you have may be something they don't feel is marketable right now. Work on something else and try them later...

mary rosenblum

trends come and go. What you couldn't sell a few years ago (fantasy) is hot right now.

geezer

If you have an agent and sell a book, is it a good odea to have a lawyer too?

mary rosenblum

No, geeze. If you have a reputable AAR agent, he or she will have a lawyer on retainer.

mary rosenblum

My agent routinely sends my contracts to her lawyer for a second opinion from time to time.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

molly22

How much insight will an agent have? And how hard is it to get an agent who knows how to make a quick sale to the right publisher?

mary rosenblum

That's kind of where you have to do your homework, molly.

mary rosenblum

Agents have a string of editors they are familiar with, and they sell mostly to them...

mary rosenblum

so most agents handle a limited range of work.

mary rosenblum

You really want an agent who handles a lot of books of the type you write.

mary rosenblum

I kind of got caught that way...my agent is a very good SF agent, but her mystery contacts are a bit limited...

mary rosenblum

but I'm not about to dump her for an agent with more mystery connections. SF is my primary love...

mary rosenblum

and she's very well established there. But it does hurt me a bit when I have a mystery novel to sell.

mary rosenblum

Then ask for a client list.

mary rosenblum

Check out those authors on amazon.com.

mary rosenblum

Are they published by major NY houses?

mary rosenblum

If not, if they're mostly published in small press....I'd be wary.

mary rosenblum

If most of them were published ten years ago and not more recently...I'd be wary.

molly22

Sorry Mary, one other part to my question...Can you get an agent first if you feel you have a good story and want to send it to a house that only takes agented manuscripts, i.e., send the ms first to an agent, then they market it?

mary rosenblum

That's how most ms are handled, molly.

mary rosenblum

A few SF houses and one...I think...mystery house still accept unagented ms.

mary rosenblum

Romance accepts unagented ms, too.

mary rosenblum

But for everything else, you must submit to an agent first and the agent then sells the book.

mary rosenblum

You can certainly help!

mary rosenblum

I often suggest an editor to my agent if I've met someone at a con and that person expresses an interest in a future project.

geezer

Would an author say who his agent is if contacted? Or is that bad form?

mary rosenblum

Well, I'd do that in person, geeze.

mary rosenblum

That's partly why you do those writers cons!

mary rosenblum

You ask people...'who's your agent? Are you happy? Are they taking new people?'

mary rosenblum

And if you hang out with a writer and you get to be buddies, you may get a personal recommendation to that writer's agent.

mary rosenblum

That's a nice toe in the door. :-)

mary rosenblum

It IS rude to ask how much money they got for thier advance. :-) The agent question is fine.

mary rosenblum

Of course, geeze, if you write to an author and it's a glowing fan letter, you love that author's book...

mary rosenblum

and you end by saying you're a new writer and how is his agent...he/she might tell you, or might not.

mary rosenblum

Depends on how that person handles fan letters, whether you 'connected' to that writer...

mary rosenblum

and so forth. But probably not.

mary rosenblum

Best to do it in person.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

But...

mary rosenblum

and this is the REAL reason you spend those conference bucks...

mary rosenblum

you can skip the agent and send direct to an editor even in a 'no unsolicited ms' house.

mary rosenblum

you do that by meeting editors at conferences. You chat with them.

mary rosenblum

You do NOT thrust your ms at them. VERY big no no.

mary rosenblum

BUT...in the course of chatting, you ask that editor 'What are you looking for these days?'

mary rosenblum

And if that editor describes something that could possibly suit your book, you say, Gee, I have this thriller, set in whereever... Would you be interested in taking a look at it?"

mary rosenblum

And if it's what that editor just got done saying he wanted, and you're not being obnoxious, he'll probably say yes.

mary rosenblum

And then...it is a solicited ms.

mary rosenblum

You send it to that editor addressed to him by name, and you remind him of the meeting in your cover letter.

mary rosenblum

I had such a great time talking with you at Midwest Writers Con. Thanks so much for being willing to look at Meister Dawn. I know you're busy...

mary rosenblum

and I really appreciate your time. I hope you enjoy it.

mary rosenblum

And you're on the editor's desk without an agent.

mary rosenblum

If the editor says yes, then you get an agent.

mary rosenblum

NEVER sign a NY publishing contract without an agent!

mary rosenblum

Actually, let me except Romance from taht...at least Harlequin .

mary rosenblum

Those contracts are iron bound.

mary rosenblum

My agent tells me they can't make many changes at all, and that you can safely sign it without an agent.

mary rosenblum

So if you're pitching romance to Harlequin, why spend the 15% if you don't have to?

mary rosenblum

If Harlequin likes your style, you can keep publishing with them forever.

robastor

Why such a difference between romance and other genres?

mary rosenblum

Romance is an interesting industry. It has the biggest readership of all fiction an the BIG fish is Harlequin.

mary rosenblum

Now I did NOT say you should sign any other NY romance publisher's contracat without an agent!

mary rosenblum

All the publishers do romance lines, and those contracts are nine pages long, legal size paper, 10 point type, single space.

mary rosenblum

And my agent makes changes in just about every paragraph!

mary rosenblum

Harlequin simply won't negotiate and doesn't have to. :-)

mary rosenblum

Doesn't mean they're fair....just means they won't negotiate. But they're pretty straightforward about what they're offering.

mary rosenblum

A lot of what agents fix are arcane issues such as how returns are accounted, and how royalty money is calculated...

mary rosenblum

and so forth. And of course, rights.

mary rosenblum

Which rights you assign and for how long and which you retain.

mary rosenblum

The small press contracts are much simpler, but if you don't clearly understand what you are signing...

mary rosenblum

you should get a publishing attorney to look at it. That'll cost you a flat fee.

mary rosenblum

Most of the time.

mary rosenblum

Maybe an hourly rate.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

Gee, you all are short of questions, tonight. Have I covered everything so thoroughly then? :-)

wolf122

Could you cover the theoretical meaning of the universe again? :)

mary rosenblum

Sure, wolfie. It's 44.

telcontar

off the beaten topics, but how do you poison a half-tiger, half-human in a fantasy?? grins

mary rosenblum

Oh, these are fun. :-) Well, tel,it's YOUR universe...

mary rosenblum

how about a nice plant?

mary rosenblum

Plants can be SO lethal. :-)

geezer

How about the Heisenberg Uncertainty Priniple?

mary rosenblum

Ha, I get to deal with that in my SF from time to time. :-)

janecj333

44. I didn't know that! ...so, I'm thinking that ten years ago, before the internet, we writers didn't have a place to vent our frustrations or search for solutions.

mary rosenblum

You know Jane, it's true. I started breaking into the writing world right before the internet had its birth, and when...

mary rosenblum

the first chat site went up...clunky tho it was.... GEnie...it was a HUGE hit.

mary rosenblum

Suddenly we could all whine...er talk...to each other all the time.

sallyk

Would you go over reprints - reselling non-fiction?

mary rosenblum

reprints are free money,sally.

mary rosenblum

I love them.

mary rosenblum

They work for both fiction and nonfiction...some of my stories have been published four or five times.

mary rosenblum

That's why you do NOT sell ALL RIGHTS.

mary rosenblum

Once you have sold first rights, you can sell second (reprint) rights, anthology rights, book club rights, movie rights, electronic rights...

mary rosenblum

if you haven't sold those rights.

mary rosenblum

Geneally you get less money for reprintes...anywhere from 10% to 50% of the original sale price.

mary rosenblum

But all you do is....nothing. Generally an editor will contact you with a request, or you...

mary rosenblum

may find markets...like LR...that buys reprint rights preferentially.

lore alley

I have characters who insist they're part of a story that...

lore alley

I don't think they suit. I've tried playing God and kicking

lore alley

them out but they're being rather firm...

lore alley

Could I be wrong?

mary rosenblum

Well, Lore, that's something YOU have to decide. I"m going to shake my finger at you a bit here. While it's fun to pretend...

mary rosenblum

that characters come to life, and of course, that's what we are trying to do to them...

mary rosenblum

they are still YOUR constructs, and they don't have ONE bit of say over whether they're in your story or not. :-)

mary rosenblum

But it rather sounds as if you're not really sure whether they do or not.

mary rosenblum

Maybe you should put it aside for a week and let it percolate in your back brain.

mary rosenblum

See what decision finally seems right. OR..

mary rosenblum

and this is something that has sometimes worked for me...

mary rosenblum

try changing your plot.

mary rosenblum

You may simply not realize what the strongest issue is for this group of characters..

mary rosenblum

and maybe if you change your plot a bit, you'll find that suddenly they all fit.

mary rosenblum

Sometimes you just miss the central issue in a story.

mary rosenblum

This is our After Hours Forum, with me, Mary Rosenblum, your web editor. It's an open question night! Anything goes. I've published seven novels (number eight will be out in November) , more than 60 short stories, and will do my best to answer any questions you have. If you're new here, remember that you need to click on the 'Ask a Question' button or the 'word bubble' next to the red question mark at the top of the screen in order to ask a question. Your regular 'send' bar won't reach me! Or you can use /ask and type your question into the regular send bar if that works better for you..

mary rosenblum

Hello, sundale. :-)

mary rosenblum

Do feel free to comment...send it as a question so it'll show up in the transcript.

mary rosenblum

Beryl asked what do we need to think about as far as promoting a book.

mary rosenblum

That's up to you, Beryl, and depends on how you publish.

mary rosenblum

If you publish through a small press house or on your own...

mary rosenblum

you really won't have wide distribution,so a serious effort on your part is going to result in sales.

mary rosenblum

The more publicity you create, the more books you'll sell.

mary rosenblum

Send copies to the reviewer at your local paper, and major metropolitan papers all over the US if you can afford it.

mary rosenblum

Try to set up signings at local bookstores, offer to come talk at local events...

mary rosenblum

do anything and everything you can to get yourself noticed.

mary rosenblum

If you publish with a big NY house you're going to get a MUCH wider distribution and...

mary rosenblum

your own promotional efforts won't have as big an effect.

robastor

How you feel about press releases as a form of promotion?

mary rosenblum

By all means!

geezer

Some magazines take book reviews. Do you think they'd take a review of the author's own book?

mary rosenblum

Not usually, geeze. :-) You're hardly unbiased.

mary rosenblum

Usually they have regular reviewers and when authors send books (do that!) they...

mary rosenblum

distribute them to their reviewers who then write reviews.

mary rosenblum

Many publishers will do that for you even in small press. NY houses always do.

mary rosenblum

They publish bound galleys or review copies and distribute them very early. My novel, due out in November, went out as review copy a month ago or more.

ltsonya

what about in nonfiction when you want to interview someone and have different slant ideas, can use a few of the quotes over again? or do they have to be different ones all together?

mary rosenblum

Good question, lt!

mary rosenblum

You can repeat the same quotes in various articles.

mary rosenblum

In fact, when you interview that expert, ask all the questions you can think of.

mary rosenblum

You may come up with a new slant and want to do a different article later, and hopefully you'll already have the quotes for it.

mary rosenblum

I have indeed run across the same quote in two different article written by the same author. :-)

mary rosenblum

One article was a commentary piece and the other was an informational piece.

ltsonya

great! that makes my life a little bit easier if i can reuse some quotes

mary rosenblum

It's the slant that matters, lt...not the actual material.

mary rosenblum

The idea is that your second article is not taking readers away from the publisher of the first article.

janecj333

How about a short fiction piece published in one form, then offered to another publisher in expanded form. Is it considered a reprint?

mary rosenblum

Tha'ts a fuzzy line, Jane. It has to be 'significantly different' but that's going to be open to interpretation.

mary rosenblum

Certainly a couple of my short stories had a rebirth as chapter one in a couple of novels. :-)

mary rosenblum

But those rights are different and they didn't conflict.

mary rosenblum

I don't think you could dramatically alter the length of a story without changing the plot significantly...

mary rosenblum

not if both stories were good.

mary rosenblum

Plot dictates length.

mary rosenblum

So there shouldn't be a problem.

mary rosenblum

Well, you all came up with some good questions.

mary rosenblum

Do join us Sunday for our casual chat...

mary rosenblum

where we get together to simply talk.

mary rosenblum

It's a lot of fun,and you can meet potential readers, for when your story is ready for that critque. :-)

 

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