Forum Transcripts

Creative Nonfiction

April 7, 2009

 

 

Mary Rosenblum:  We're talking about creative nonfiction today, in all its forms.  This is a form of writing that uses the techniques of fiction, but offers the readers a 'real story'. It can be a memoir about the author's life, or a personal essay about a topic.
Based on real life events?
Mary Rosenblum:  Exactly, Flora. Readers LOVE truth, and creative nonficiton is actually a much larger market than the short fiction market these days.
How liberal can we be with the creativity?
Mary Rosenblum:  Ingrid, that is a fuzzy line, but has received some serious spotlight attention recently, thanks to a couple of journalists whose 'nonfiction' turned out to be entirely made up. So while you can't be expected to remember Aunt Flora's conversation verbatim when she told off Uncle Bert at the family reunion five years ago  and you are not expected to render it accurately, you cannot make up an Aunt Fiona.
Okay, thanks.
Mary Rosenblum:  You can fill in dialogue and details that you can't quite recall perfectly but you CANNOT MAKE UP PEOPLE AND EVENTS.  So as I said, the line is fuzzy.
Does  it require research?
Mary Rosenblum:  Not really, Flora, since it does require that you were present at the time.  At least for memoir and personal narrative. Historical writing isn't the same as creative nonfiction. When you start imagining Ben Franklin's life, for example, that is considered historical fiction if you're having him talk and act, the way you'd have a novel character talk and act.
So, what if you were four years old and you recall the event and even the details but no one else (alive) does?

Mary Rosenblum:  Then, Ingrid, you tell the version that you remember.  

If making a loose quote of "Aunt Fiona" is it best to let her read the work and approve its content before seeking publication?

Mary Rosenblum:  It's not legally required, Gail. It depends on your relationship with your family and how you want it to continue.
That’s  also a question for fiction writing...for instance....if you want to write historical fiction....how accurate should you be about the dates etc....?
Mary Rosenblum:  Flora, VERY. The historical fiction readers expect every bit of accuracy you can scrape out of your research.
What if u make it up and it sounds excellent? would you place it under the genre of fiction even though the writer intended it to be non-fiction?

Mary Rosenblum:   Flora if you make it up is IS fiction. Nonfiction means it really happened, that it is not made up.

Yes Mary, What is the liability factor here?
Mary Rosenblum:  JRP, the only liability is libel. If you libel, you are liable. You can get sued. If you say that Uncle Bert is an idiot with his head where the sun don't shine, that's your opinion and between you and Uncle Bert.
So it is conceivable that a relative or heir could take you to court?
Mary Rosenblum:   JRP, there is nothing to prevent anyone from taking you to court. A judge will only rule against you if the prosecuting attorney can prove libel -- i.e. that the defendant’s reputation and/or career were substantially damaged.  It's probably more conceivable that Uncle Bert will simply punch you in the nose. Attorneys and courts cost a lot! Personally,  I think it behooves you to change names. I personally don't think it is ethical to put people on the public stage like that.
Mary, aside from memoir and personal narrative, what are the other forms of creative non-fiction?
Mary Rosenblum:   Dale, mostly you find stories by authors about their personal experiences -- personal memoir, personal narrative -- they mean the same thing.  Then you find authors writing about real people doing real things -- a local hero, the woman who has rescued and homed 1000 unwanted dogs, that sort of thing.  Creative nonfiction. It's told more like a story, with visuals, less like an informative article. If you read your newspaper's Sunday supplement section, you'll often find these 'human interest' stories.
So like fiction, the focus here is on the people? No creative non-fiction versions of the how-to for instance:)
Mary Rosenblum:   Exactly, Dale, that's a good distinction. Creative nonfiction is all about entertainment. Informative NF is about offering information. You still want that information to be entertaining in its own way, but the main purpose is the info. Not so with creative Nonfiction.

Aren’t all novels for entertainment?
Mary Rosenblum:   Flora novels are fiction.  Novels are not nonfiction. You can have a memoir that is book length, but it is not a novel. It's very important to make that distinction between 'truth' and 'fiction'. It is not usually a good idea to mix them.  Many of my students want to 'fictionalize' a personal story. Generally, that does not succeed well.
What if in some fiction stories...there's some form of truth in it...yet its told in a metaphorical way or through some fictional object/character
Mary Rosenblum:   Believe me, there are elements of truth in all fiction. :-) Often they're not very obvious.
Mary, If I were writing a piece about a local health clinic for instance, and wanted to approach it as if I were a patient going through the process, would that be ok?
Mary Rosenblum:     Sure, lady, but it's probably not going to be creative nonfiction. It's going to be an informational piece -- about the clinic -- told with a strong personal voice.
Would Erma Bombeck be an example of creative nonfiction, seeing as her stories are personal?
Mary Rosenblum:     Yes, Beth, Erma Bombeck is an excellent example of creative nonfiction.

And Truman Capote's In Cold Blood.

Mary Rosenblum:     Jerry, Capote was the forefather, if you will, of the large creative nonfiction market. He wrote abut that real crime as if it was a suspense novel, but he used real people and real facts.

But  even though creative nonfiction is all about entertainment, you still need to send a message within it , right?
Mary Rosenblum: Milly, yes, you have touched on the central core of creative nonfiction.  It has to have a universal appeal...not necessarily a message  but something that readers can identify with and embrace.  If it's just YOUR story, why should we care?
I think a personal essay would have to offer more than just me, me, me.....wouldn't it?
Mary Rosenblum:     Exactly, jrp. Unless you are a major celebrity and hoards of people care what you eat for breakfast.
So non-fiction is straightforward and is exclusively memoirs ?
Mary Rosenblum: Not at all, Flora. Nonfiction is quite a spectrum, running from very dry journal pieces intended for experts who want information only, to more 'accessible' pieces that convey information in an entertaining style, to personal stories told by the author that have a universal appeal.
To touch back on an earlier point--creative non-fiction needs to be "true" in who what where and when but can be more, well,
creative with the details, so long as the intent of the people involved is preserved? I'm still a bit unclear on how "fuzzy" so to speak the details in creative NF can be compared to standard NF

Mary Rosenblum: It's hard to create a cut and dried 'this but not that', Dale. As long as the events happened as you describe, the same people were there, and you convey the gist of the conversation, you're fine.
so what is the relationship between creative non fiction and literary journals? I often read their submission guidelines to include creative nonfiction.
Mary Rosenblum: Literary journals are simply magazines subsidized usually by a university creative writing program, Milly.  Some publish nonfiction some do not. They don't want 'how to' or information, they want creative nonfiction with a literary style.
What is a literary style? I've heard that term repeatedly.
Mary Rosenblum:: Milly, that's really a topic for an entire Forum. It has to do with the dominance of literary style in the piece, rather than plot/character/conflict.  How you use the words is as important as what you convey.
Like something that James Joyce would write?
Mary Rosenblum: You got it.  We'll talk about it at our next Tuesday Forum, on April 21.   It really is a full hour conversation. But as to creative nonfiction, let's talk about markets. Very few magazines are dedicated to 'personal narratives' only and most of them are meant for novice writers and don't really have much distribution.  If you are publishing short pieces, you don't want to look for a magazine that simply publishes random creative nonfiction.  You can, but that may not be your best market choice.  Instead, think about your topic. What does your narrative include? If it includes gardening, say your narrator is in her garden as the event you are describing unfolds, try the gardening magazines. Bailey White, who writes about her southern family and neighbors, published some of her short narratives in gardening magazines, because many of her narratives include a garden. They are not ABOUT gardens.
I have a talented student who writes about his life in the Louisiana bayous. I have pushed him to send them to the outdoor mags -- hunting and fishing.  They're not about hunting and fishing, but the guys who read those magazines will love his voice and what he writes about...and most DO include hunting of some sort.  You simply find a match for what your nonfiction piece includes and readers of some magazine somewhere. And just as with any nonfiction marketplace, it's not a bad idea to write that personal narrative with a particular market or group of markets in mind.
Got some good dog stories? You can find several major dog magazines that take creative nonfiction.
Nearly all nonfiction magazines will take creative nonfiction if it suits their readers.
Question, Mary What does Bailey White write about in the garden mags?
Mary Rosenblum: Bss, she is a very popular writer now and mostly sells her work as collections, but some of her short stories involving family events that were somehow connected to gardening, did get published first in garden mags.  Those were stories she sold early on, before her popularity increased and she could sell as herself in a collection. That's how you get started -- publishing short pieces in magazines.
Mary, I have a piece about my passion for a fruit called persimmon. where can I publish it?
Mary Rosenblum:   Well, Milly, what's a persimmon? A fruit, right?
Yea.
Mary Rosenblum: What batch of readers might have an interest in persimmons, eh? What magazines might they read?  Gardening mags?

Good Housekeeping food section

Mary Rosenblum:   Yeah, jrp, GH but not the food section. They do publish personal narrative, but there, the persimmon love would probably need a strong family connection to interest those readers.
Thank you, Mary, now define collections please
Mary Rosenblum:   A collection ,bss, is a book length group of short stories, or short NF narratives, published under a single cover, either paperback or hardcover (or in eformat).
Say you wrote a personal narrative about a heartwarming family Thanksgiving. Now there's a personal narrative to send to Good Housekeeping, Family Circle, something like that.  And by the way, all you novice writers, it's a LOT easier to break into the large circulation mags with a personal narrative than it is to break in with an informational piece.

Sunset rejected me.
Mary Rosenblum:   Do you know what a rejection slip means, Milly? It means send it to a new market. And of course, the tone and style of Milly's piece will also determine who might be interested. Every magazine out there has a particular style or tone.
How about a personal narrative about life with a schizophrenic?

Mary Rosenblum:  Ingrid, that's a strong human interest piece. You might try Sunday supplements or one of the magazines written for people with disabilities or mental health issues, maybe it will suit a magazine about spirituality, personal growth, it depends on what's in the piece and how you wrote it.
So  we're talking only magazine writing?
No.  Book length creative nonfiction is very popular. IN general, it's more popular than fiction, with a MUCH larger readership pool.  I have a student, for example, that grew up in Nazi Germany and is writing a memoir about her family's cross country trek to escape the country. They ended up in Canada. With the strength of the WWII nostalgia market, I think she'll sell to a major publisher.
Mostly the big publishers want a: a celebrity name b: an interesting topic/location. If you're not a celbrity, you have to offer something else to interest readers -- like my student's Nazi Germany escape as a child.
Is there much of a small press market for book length creative non fiction?

Mary Rosenblum:  Yes, there certainly is.  It’s more open than the big NY publishers.   And by celebrity name, I mean that they'd love to publish Brittney Spears' memoir! But if you're not her, then you have to find something else to interest readers.
How do you build your name in the publishing world before you hit your big title.
Mary Rosenblum:  If you're just writing about your family, and there's no particularly interesting events for readers, it's probably not going to interest a publisher. Self publish it for your grandkids. You only build your name in the publishing world in two ways, Milly. One, you're a big name in other areas -- a rock star, sports star, etc. Or , two, you sell LOTS of books and get national attention. And that last is a bit of a Catch 22 isn't it? :-)
As to personal memoir, if it includes events that will interest readers who don't know you or care about you, it's going to interest publishers. If it's just a story of your family having picnics, it really is something to self publish.

Does it help to publish short pieces first?
Mary Rosenblum:  Milly, it certainly does.  Most of the well known creative NF writers: Andre Codrescu (literary), Bailey White, Patrick McManus, started out with the occasional short piece and they were VERY popular.  As their popularity and name recognition increased, they got contracts for collections.

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