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mary rosenblum
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Hello all. I hope you had an
enjoyable and pleasantly spooky Halloween!
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mary rosenblum
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We're currently enjoying our
second big Pacific storm in two days, so I'd say winter has officially
arrived.
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mary rosenblum
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If anyone would like a few
inches of rain, I'll do my best to oblige you.
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mary rosenblum
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This is the Tuesday Forum with
me Mary Rosenblum LR Web Editor, fiction and nonfiction writer and we’re
choreographing scenes. If you’re new here, remember that you need to click
on the Ask a Question button or the word bubble next to the red question
mark at the top of the screen, or use the ask a question icon in order to
ask a question. Your regular send bar won’t reach me! You can also type
/ask in front of your question to reach me.
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mary rosenblum
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I wanted to talk a bit about
scenes and what they are.
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mary rosenblum
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A lot of novice writers end up
with a story that has a 'flat' feel...
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mary rosenblum
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because they really don't
understand how to choreograph a scene.
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mary rosenblum
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I should probably start out
here by defining a scene
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lore alley
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Mary, I'm going to ask the
question right away that is the most on my mind (because of NaNo ;-). Do you
worry about scene choreography in the first draft??? Or is this a revision
type of thing?
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mary rosenblum
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Lore, this is one of those
things that you need to pay attention to in two stages, and yes, one stage
is the first draft.
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mary rosenblum
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For those of you working on
Nano novels (The National Novel Writing challenge...write a novel in
November)...
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mary rosenblum
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a chapter is composed of one
or several scenes...
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mary rosenblum
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and a chapter...even one that
includes more than one scene...follows the same choreography of a scene.
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mary rosenblum
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So this should be extra
helpful for you.
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mary rosenblum
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Okay...a scene is a sequence
of action that occurs continuously in one place and time in one POV.
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mary rosenblum
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If you shift POV, if you leap
ahead to the next day or a few hours from now...if you skip over to a new
setting...
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mary rosenblum
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you have a new scene.
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mary rosenblum
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Scenes are like beads that you
string into a necklace that is the story.
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mary rosenblum
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The first draft part of
creating the strong scene is simply knowing WHY it's there.
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mary rosenblum
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Every scene has a reason for
its existance...in fact it has three reasons.
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mary rosenblum
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It needs to 1: Advance the
Plot.
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mary rosenblum
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2: Deepen the Characterization
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mary rosenblum
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3: Enrich the Setting.
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mary rosenblum
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This is what I call the Rule
of Three.
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mary rosenblum
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I see quite a few novice
scenes that simply carry the MC through a boring day at work.
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mary rosenblum
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Bores the reader, too!
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mary rosenblum
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All you need to know when you
write the first draft is 'why is this here?'
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mary rosenblum
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YOu might need to reveal the
MC's fear of spiders, or let us find out that the MC's brother is helping
the bad guys, or something like that.
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mary rosenblum
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This might be where your MC
finds evidence to make her suspect her new love is married.
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mary rosenblum
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Something important is
revealed.
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mary rosenblum
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This is the Tuesday Forum with
me Mary Rosenblum LR Web Editor, fiction and nonfiction writer and we’re
choreographing scenes. If you’re new here, remember that you need to click
on the Ask a Question button or the word bubble next to the red question
mark at the top of the screen, or use the ask a question icon in order to
ask a question. Your regular send bar won’t reach me! You can also type
/ask in front of your question to reach me.
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mary rosenblum
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On your second draft, you can
work on the actual choreography of that scene...
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mary rosenblum
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giving it its own dramatic arc
so that we rise to a dramatic peak, no matter how small compared to the
main climax.
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mary rosenblum
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Those dramatic peaks in each
scene...even if they are tiny...will give you a very strong forward
momentum in your story...
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mary rosenblum
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and will help keep your
readers glued to the pages. No worries about them not picking the book or
story up again after they put it down.
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cherley
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How long should a chapter be
apx. pages?
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mary rosenblum
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Cherley this is one of the
most frustrating aspects of novel writing...there is no standard.
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mary rosenblum
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Generally, the younger your
readers the shorter the chapters...
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mary rosenblum
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but for adults it's entirely
up to your natural writing rhythms.
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mary rosenblum
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Generally a chapter is either
one scene or a couple of scenes.
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mary rosenblum
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You, as a writer, will develop
a 'scene length' that works for you, and you'll find that your scenes tend
to turn out to be about that length most of the time.
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mary rosenblum
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My own 'natural scene length'
is a bit short of 20 pages.
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mary rosenblum
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So that tends to be how long
my chapters are, and they tend to be comprised of a single scene.
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mary rosenblum
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My SF writer friend Mike is
very different.
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mary rosenblum
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His natural scene length is
about ten pages.
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mary rosenblum
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It's what works comfortably
for you.
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kungfumama
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Mary, is that your double-spaced
typewritten pages, or finished product?
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mary rosenblum
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They actually come out close
to the same, kungfu. :-)
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mary rosenblum
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I'm talking ds manuscript
pages, but that's about the name number of mass market paperback pages.
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cherley
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Mine seem to be 4 pages
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mary rosenblum
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Then you would probably
include multiple scenes in a chapter, cherley...
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mary rosenblum
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but I'll bet that as you
increase your level of craft that your scenes grow.
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mary rosenblum
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A lot of novice writers write
very short scenes because they're leaving a lot out...characterization,
rich visuals...
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mary rosenblum
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and as they begin to master
the complex balance of pacing and detail, their scene length grows.
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cherley
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How long should a book for a
series be apx.?
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mary rosenblum
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That depends entirely on the
publisher, Cherley.
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mary rosenblum
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If you look at the guidelines
for various publishers, you'll see what they recommend as 'best lengths'.
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mary rosenblum
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Generally, for an adult novel,
you're looking at 70,000 - 100,000 words.
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mary rosenblum
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But some publishers want
shorter or longer.
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mary rosenblum
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Longer is usually better. :-)
Up to a point. Generally , it is better to cut than to add.
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cherley
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What's the difference between a
novel and a book?
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mary rosenblum
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A book is fiction or
nonfiction, cherley. A novel is fiction only.
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mary rosenblum
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This is the Tuesday Forum with
me Mary Rosenblum LR Web Editor, fiction and nonfiction writer and we’re
choreographing scenes. If you’re new here, remember that you need to click
on the Ask a Question button or the word bubble next to the red question
mark at the top of the screen, or use the ask a question icon in order to
ask a question. Your regular send bar won’t reach me! You can also type
/ask in front of your question to reach me.
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mary rosenblum
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Once you have your first draft
scene, it's time to take a look at the choreography of that scene.
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cherley
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I thought it had something to do
with length.
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mary rosenblum
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Nope.
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mary rosenblum
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Some books are very short.
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mary rosenblum
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Although for award categories
'novel' is generally accepted to be a work of 40,000 words or more.
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mary rosenblum
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But that is pretty short for
most novel publishers.
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mary rosenblum
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Nearly every scene should have
a natural peak of rising action.
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mary rosenblum
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That is, the tension and
intensity of the scene should increase to this point.
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mary rosenblum
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That may come at the end of
the scene with a transition to the next scene (or chapter if this is also
your chapter)...
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mary rosenblum
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or the tension may drop off as
the scene transitions to the next one.
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kungfumama
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Is that generally when you had
the 'high notes' - the little twists of interests?
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mary rosenblum
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Yes, kung.
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mary rosenblum
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If your scene is breakfast
together, your high point might be when hubby says something...
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mary rosenblum
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that makes the wife realize he
lied about where he was last night.
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mary rosenblum
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You might create rising action
by showing us her increasing annoyance at his unexpected bad humor...
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mary rosenblum
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building to his comment and
her sudden flash of realization. He wasn't at Bob's last night.
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kungfumama
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but a twist might be the husband
dropping a knife with butter - when he's normally not so clumsy?
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mary rosenblum
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I think a better word would be
plant, kung...
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mary rosenblum
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a plant is a clue that tips us
off to something either now or later.
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mary rosenblum
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If he drops that knife it
indicates what? Maybe he's tense and hiding it.
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mary rosenblum
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Or drunk. Or angry. Or
something she said just startled him.
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mary rosenblum
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It indicates something is not
right for him....or that's what most readers will assume.
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mary rosenblum
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Alone, it won't make much of a
high point...
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mary rosenblum
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BUT...if she has just told him
that she heard Butch Miller was murdered last night...
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mary rosenblum
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and hubby drops his glass of
orange juice...AHA!
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mary rosenblum
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THat's a perfectly good
dramatic peak for the scene and makes us guess that hubby has some
connection to Butch or the murder...
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mary rosenblum
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even if his wife misses it.
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mary rosenblum
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The climax of the scene also
shines a spotlight on what happens...
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mary rosenblum
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so generally, the climax of
the scene also points the readers' attention to what we want the reader to
'get' in this scene...
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mary rosenblum
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OR...it can be a marvelous
device for hiding clues in a mystery.
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mary rosenblum
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If you need to plant a clue
that will point to your real killler, but you don't want the reader to
guess who dunnit before the end...
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mary rosenblum
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You plant the clue in a scene
where something else is the climax of the scene.
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mary rosenblum
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Readers pay attention to that
climax and probably miss your sneaked-in clue.
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mary rosenblum
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For example, if Wife mentions
the murder and hubby drops his glass...we assume he's involved right?
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mary rosenblum
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But if she mentioned that
Sandy's ne'er do well son is back in town and then talks about the murder
we probably won't pay much attention to ne'er do well...
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mary rosenblum
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because our attention is
caught by the glass and our suspicion about hubby.
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mary rosenblum
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AT the end of the mystery we
may find out that ne'er do well was the killer and that comment is a clue
that he was in town at the time of the murder.
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mary rosenblum
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This is the Tuesday Forum with
me Mary Rosenblum LR Web Editor, fiction and nonfiction writer and we’re
choreographing scenes. If you’re new here, remember that you need to click
on the Ask a Question button or the word bubble next to the red question
mark at the top of the screen, or use the ask a question icon in order to
ask a question. Your regular send bar won’t reach me! You can also type
/ask in front of your question to reach me.
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cherley
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how would you write a heart
wrenching scream. Like spelling it out?
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mary rosenblum
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It is generally a good idea
not to get too specific about that sort of thing, cherley.
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mary rosenblum
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Remember that you are writing
for a LARGE number of readers.
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mary rosenblum
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What sounds 'heart wrenching'
to you may make me giggle.
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mary rosenblum
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Not good.
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mary rosenblum
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He screamed is fine.
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mary rosenblum
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If you want it to be heart
wrenching, that sense should come out of the context of the scene.
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mary rosenblum
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If he walks out the door to
find the body of his beloved son on the front porch with his throat cut, we
KNOW that scream is heart wrenching.
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mary rosenblum
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Each of us will hear what
sounds heart wrenching to us.
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mary rosenblum
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You shoul d not have to TELL
us it is.
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mary rosenblum
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I f you do need to tell us
that it is heart wrenching, you have now showed us enough of the story.
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cherley
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What about the sound of a cop
car or ambulance.. Eeewa?
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mary rosenblum
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Bad idea to spell out any
sound.
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mary rosenblum
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Let the reader hear what
he/she thinks it sounds like.
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mary rosenblum
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Remember...the more you let
the reader build the world, the more that world is real to the reader.
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janecj333
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maybe the hubby can find his
girlfriend's panties in his pocket at the same moment the wife mentions the
murder...when the hubby drops his juice, the wife may incorrectly suspect
him of the wrong wrongdoing
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mary rosenblum
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Exactly, jane. It might be
safer to let him put his hand in his pocket as she mentions the murder and
then drop the juice without showing us the panties...
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mary rosenblum
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if you want to hide that clue
from us.
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mary rosenblum
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We can find out later it was
the panties that made him drop the juice. :-)
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kungfumama
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Is there an easy way to
determine if you're adding tension or over embellishing? Other than by gut
feeling?
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mary rosenblum
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Reader feedback will help you,
kung.
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mary rosenblum
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It IS easy to add so much
detail that the rising drama is obscured.
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mary rosenblum
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And it's easy to have so
little detail that the rising drama is just to spare.
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mary rosenblum
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So much of strong writing is a
balancing act...walking a line between too much and not enough.
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mary rosenblum
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And that, folks, is why you
don't sit down and write one story and decide if you have 'talent' or not.
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mary rosenblum
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The biggest part of writing
is...writing. Doing it. Doing it again. Again. Again. Each time getting a
little closer...
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mary rosenblum
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to those balance points. Hey,
it's better. A little better...
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mary rosenblum
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Oh, now I see how to do this.
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mary rosenblum
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Another good way to get a feel
for 'enough' versus 'too much' is to stop when you find yourself...
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mary rosenblum
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reading a scene or chapter
that has TOTALLY glued you to the page.
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mary rosenblum
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Go back. Read it again, but
this time, analyze what that writer is doing.
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mary rosenblum
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Is the prose spare? How is he
using his visuals?
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mary rosenblum
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How many details does he
include? WHY couldn't you put this scene down?
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mary rosenblum
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WHY did it hold your attention
that closely.
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mary rosenblum
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Then...an excellent
exercise....
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mary rosenblum
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Close the book or magazine and
rewrite the scene. Use different character names but do the exact same
thing.
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mary rosenblum
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Then compare.
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mary rosenblum
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If you have an eidetic memory
this will not work. :-)
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mary rosenblum
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But otherwise, you won't do an
exact copy, but you can see how your attempt to do what that writer did
compares.
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cherley
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In a Cozy Mystery would it be
not so much glued to the page?
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mary rosenblum
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If your reader is not glued to
the page, why should that person not put it down and read something else
cherley?
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mary rosenblum
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Glued to the page has nothing
to do with what is happening.
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mary rosenblum
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It has everything to do with
how YOU tell the story.
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geezer
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A what memory?
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mary rosenblum
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A photographic memory, geeze.
:-)
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mary rosenblum
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You can keep your reader glued
to the page while your MC uses the bathroom!
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mary rosenblum
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It's how you do it.
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mary rosenblum
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And that is a common
misconception.
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mary rosenblum
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"If I put a ton of
violence in my story...wow! Nobody will be able to put it down. '
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mary rosenblum
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Not so. :-)
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mary rosenblum
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But seriously, copying another
writer's style, voice, technique is not going to turn you into a carbon
copy of that person...
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mary rosenblum
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but it's a nice exercise in
intentionally trying something different.
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mary rosenblum
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Your own voice will evolve on
its own.
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lore alley
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This question is way past what
we were discussing thanks to my noncooperating computer. But... my first
chapter has three scenes. The first two are pretty "flat" but the
third has a good arc (plane crashes ;-). Should I make them into one scene?
Take the first two out? Add some drama? (They're mostly backstory right now
with some setting and character development.) Does adding internal conflict
work?
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mary rosenblum
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Since you're writing a novel
and not a short story, lore, I'd say that your first chapter structure...
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mary rosenblum
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of two backstory scenes and
your dramatic main plot element (I assume that's what the crash is)...
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mary rosenblum
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work just fine as a first
chapter.
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mary rosenblum
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Yes, you need to hold the
reader through those first backstory scenes...
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mary rosenblum
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and you do that by creating a
dramatic arc for each of those scenes.
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mary rosenblum
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Something important happens as
we learn backstory.
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mary rosenblum
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I would not do a huge amount
of author narrative and then begin the action...
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mary rosenblum
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but rather let us follow your
MC as she/she does whatever and we'll learn through her
thoughts/dialogue/actions about the backstory.
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mary rosenblum
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Think about what is to come
and find some small dramatic peak...internal conflict is quite good...that
has a bearing on the story.
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lore alley
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it's not narrative. I'm showing,
not telling :-) Its just not as exciting.
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mary rosenblum
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That's fine, lore. It needs to
hold the reader, but remember...your chapter has its OWN dramatic arc...
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mary rosenblum
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and the peak of that is your
plane crash. So even a bit of a tense interchange over the cell phone can
be enough of a peak...
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mary rosenblum
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or you can plant 'omens' that
tell us trouble is coming.
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mary rosenblum
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Your MC is uneasy...she stares
at the flight insurance kiosk and shivers..
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mary rosenblum
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Why is she even looking at it?
She has never even thought about this before. Maybe it's all that worry
about...
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mary rosenblum
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whatever.
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cherley
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I try to get by without much
narrative but then it seems like too much dialogue.
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mary rosenblum
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Then you need strong beats of
visuals or thought, cherley.
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mary rosenblum
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You might want to read the
article on beats. They are a powerful tool and can keep you away from
narrative.
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mary rosenblum
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It's in the Writing Craft:
Craft section.
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mary rosenblum
|
This is the Tuesday Forum with
me Mary Rosenblum LR Web Editor, fiction and nonfiction writer and we’re
choreographing scenes. If you’re new here, remember that you need to click
on the Ask a Question button or the word bubble next to the red question mark
at the top of the screen, or use the ask a question icon in order to ask a
question. Your regular send bar won’t reach me! You can also type /ask in
front of your question to reach me.
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mary rosenblum
|
Lore, I would decide on
something that will add a sense of drama to come in those two first scenes.
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mary rosenblum
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YOur MC might be reflecting on
relationship problems...
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mary rosenblum
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suffering that
premonition...might have a fight with someone on the phone...
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mary rosenblum
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you can create a sense of
increasing tension as small events get in her way...
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mary rosenblum
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make her late...frustrate her.
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mary rosenblum
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You simply want to avoid a
flat 'let's get all this backstory over with' tone.
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mary rosenblum
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And remember...we are willing
to keep getting backstory right up until the climax of the story. :-)
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mary rosenblum
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It should not ALL be stuffed
into the opening!
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mary rosenblum
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Just include the bare minimum
that will allow the reader to understand ...just barely...what is going on.
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mary rosenblum
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Keep our curiosity aroused.
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mary rosenblum
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Another good exercise...one I
give writing workshop students...
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mary rosenblum
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is to make a very boring
scene...exciting.
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mary rosenblum
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Making breakfast.
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mary rosenblum
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Raking leaves.
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mary rosenblum
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and without introducing ANY
external plot elements.
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mary rosenblum
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It has to all come from
dialogue between characters or internal POV.
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mary rosenblum
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The reason that this is a good
exercise...
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mary rosenblum
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is that you learn how to
create drama through description.
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mary rosenblum
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Thoughts and dialogue on their
own may give us the basic dramatic rise...an arguement...
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mary rosenblum
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our dropped glass at the
mention of the murder...
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mary rosenblum
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but it is how our characters
act that support that rising drama.
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mary rosenblum
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It's much easier to do, of
course, if you MC is fighting off a dragon. :-)
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trainer
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You may have already done so
Mary, (my connection's being stupid today) but could you give us an example
to see what your talking about. i.e. raking leaves?
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mary rosenblum
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Sure trainer.
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mary rosenblum
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Joann stuggled with the sticky
shed door. How many times had she asked Dave to fix this? It banged open
and nearly fell on her butt.
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mary rosenblum
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Stupid trees. Stupid big yard.
She snatched the rake from the tool rack, ducked as a shovel handle
attacked her. Stupid husband who wanted to live in the boonies and didn't
do any work. Lugging the rake she headed for the back yard.
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mary rosenblum
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A tide of dead leaves greeted
her. She dragged the rake across the mess. Couldn't even see grass. Stupid
trees!
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mary rosenblum
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Dragged again, slipped in one
of Rover's piles. "No. No." She struggled to her feet, gagging at
the smell. "I won't do it anymore. Do you hear?" She threw the
rake at the house. "No more!" It soared like a spear...
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mary rosenblum
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straight as an arrow. The
picture window shattered with the sound of crystal breaking, glittering
shards sliding slow motion down the face of the house. Joann giggled, then
laughed, bending over, hands on knees, laughing, crying, tears dripping
down onto the wet, dead leaves.
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mary rosenblum
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And in that leaf raking, with
only a bit of thought, you get the dramatic arc that runs from her grumpy
thoughts...
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mary rosenblum
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to more action...struggling to
rake the leaves...
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mary rosenblum
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to the dramatic peak of that
launched rake that shatters the window...
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mary rosenblum
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and then slacks off a bit with
her weeping...
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mary rosenblum
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which is where this might
transition to another scene.
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lore alley
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wow Mary! Nice! When do we get
to read the book? :-)
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mary rosenblum
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LOL :-)
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geezer
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Is this off the top of your
head?
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mary rosenblum
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Sure, geeze.
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mary rosenblum
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That's why it's rough.
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janecj333
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the internal pov you mention is
character action like stage directions, and also narrative such as 'the
leaves lay almost end to end, as if placed there' that have some emotional
force?
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mary rosenblum
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Yes, jane. Just make sure that
the narrative suits your POV so that we don't have a sense of the author
instruding.
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mary rosenblum
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Here, I simply described the
leaves as a 'tide'...
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mary rosenblum
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searching for a word that
coveyed a lot of leaves like an ocean...and figuring that Joann is not in a
state of mind...
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mary rosenblum
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to wax poetic about those
leaves. :-)
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cherley
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like when the people heard to
earth shattering screams they should do more than go look out the window?
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cherley
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like drop things
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mary rosenblum
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People always react physically
to what is going on...
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mary rosenblum
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either as a reaction...they
duck when someone throws a punch...
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mary rosenblum
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or more subtly...they stiffen
up when someone says something...
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mary rosenblum
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that has an emotional impact.
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mary rosenblum
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Here, I did my darndest not to
TELL the reader anything about Joann's relationship with her husband...
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mary rosenblum
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but through her thoughts and
her anger and that moment of violence when she throws the rake...
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mary rosenblum
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we will certainly get some
inkling of what is going in her life right now...
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mary rosenblum
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and readers will probably get
what I intend them to get...
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mary rosenblum
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AND this has a much stronger
dramatic arc than if I had done it in narrative...
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mary rosenblum
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and told the readers how Joann
and Dave had moved to this woodland acre a year ago...
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mary rosenblum
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and how Joann is a city girl
who just really doen't enjoy all those outdoorsy things, but Dave was
adamant about wanting to live 'out in the country'.
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cherley
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I've done the same mumbling. ; )
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mary rosenblum
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We all do, cherley. And it's
VERY useful in writing. :-)
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mary rosenblum
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Say this was part of a story
or novel I was working on.
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mary rosenblum
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My process of creating this
scene would have gone something like this.
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mary rosenblum
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scene...Joann is upset over
getting stuck with the leaf raking while Dave is off at a business
conference.
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mary rosenblum
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Maybe this is building toward
her illicit affair with someone or something.
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mary rosenblum
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And actually this is pretty
much the thought process that was running through my head as I came up with
this example.
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mary rosenblum
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Okay...she's going to rake
angrily and think about how Dave isn't doing the work and she hates it.
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mary rosenblum
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Boring. We need a peak of
drama here. One that reinforces what she is upset about.
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mary rosenblum
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Aha...
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mary rosenblum
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She loses it and throws the
rake at the house...
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mary rosenblum
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and breaks the huge, expensive
picture window...
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mary rosenblum
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which is kind of a nice
metaphor for wanting to break the marriage.
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mary rosenblum
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That'll work.
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mary rosenblum
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I could have just had her rake
the leaves and throw the rake back in the shed...
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mary rosenblum
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or give up and stomp inside to
weep into a cup of hot chocolate...
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mary rosenblum
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but this peak of violence was
much stronger and, I felt, made the point more clearly.
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mary rosenblum
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That's how you do it.
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mary rosenblum
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What do you want the reader to
take away from this scene?
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mary rosenblum
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Okay, what will give this scene
some dramatic power?
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mary rosenblum
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And if you notice...
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mary rosenblum
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in the segment where the
window breaks...
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mary rosenblum
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I did not just say...the
window broke...
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mary rosenblum
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but rather I gave you very
precise details of the sound of the glass shattering, the way the
glittering shards slid down the face of the house...
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mary rosenblum
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and those details have the
effect of zooming in on that moment and accentuating the importance of that
event.
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mary rosenblum
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I could have done the same
thing as she broke the rake into pieces...
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mary rosenblum
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focusing on the sharp
splinters of wood...
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mary rosenblum
|
of a smear of crimson blood on
her hand where she cut herself...
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mary rosenblum
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and ended with her laughing
and sobbing as I did here.
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mary rosenblum
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And those focused-in details
would have made the act of breaking the rake nearly as powerful as the
window shattering.
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janecj333
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what do you think of this kind
of narrative? 'Joann stood with a rake at the center of her yard, a
leaf-littered expanse. Ten minutes' work produced meager results. She
daydreamed that the rake might pierce the picture window, the glass sift
into the leaves, and when she threw it, it was so.
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mary rosenblum
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This is a nice example of the
narrative version of the same scene.
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mary rosenblum
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And it simply depends on the
effect you are trying to create.
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mary rosenblum
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This has a distanced, dreamy
feel to me. We are standing back watching Joann...
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mary rosenblum
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and we're probably going to
learn something by observing her do these things.
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mary rosenblum
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Because this is much more a
told story, you can use more elegant language and you're not limited to
Joann's own perceptions.
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mary rosenblum
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But you also lack the
immediate engagement that you get with limited third.
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mary rosenblum
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Each way of doing this has its
own merits and it's own limitations.
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mary rosenblum
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You choose one or the other
depending on what you are trying to accomplish with your readers. :-)
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mary rosenblum
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Well, this has been a fun
Oregon Hour.
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mary rosenblum
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I think we've gotten about
another inch of rain, too.
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mary rosenblum
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Do join us tomorrow, same time
same place for our casual get together.
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mary rosenblum
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Questions are welcome, but
it's all casual...we just get together to chat about writing.
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mary rosenblum
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And all your Nano people are
off and running.
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mary rosenblum
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Drop in and tell us how it's
going!
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mary rosenblum
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I'll post the transcript of
this in the usual place:
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mary rosenblum
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Writing Craft Forum
Transcripts.
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geezer
|
Keep it up there, please. I love
my 92F weather.
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mary rosenblum
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Ah, I'd be jealous...but 92 is
too hot for me, geeze...and my agent wants the first three chapters,
synopsis, and two proposals of a new mystery series before
Thanksgiving...so it had better keep on raining!
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mary rosenblum
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I need to keep butt in chair.
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cherley
|
Do you know if there is a good
online workshop?
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mary rosenblum
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I don't, cherley. sorry.
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roe
|
gonna have to use duct tape
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mary rosenblum
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Ah, the motivation is there.
:-)
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mary rosenblum
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Have a good day, all!
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mary rosenblum
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See you tomorrow!
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