|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Hello all.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I hope you all had an
enjoyable, long weekend.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I gues summer has officially
begun he?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I thought I'd talk about clips
today, because I get so many questions about them.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
They're helpful in both the
fiction and nonfiction arenas, but they're particularly necessary in
nonfiction, where you almost have to have clips
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
before an editor will take a
serious look at your query.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
It can seem like an
insurmountable wall...to publish you have to have clips but how do you get
published in the first plcae, so that you can have clips?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
It's not really as much a
catch-22 as it might seem.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Not a sheer wall, anyway, but
it can be a steep and rocky climb when you're a new writer and thirsting to
publish.
|
|
destiny8
|
My Irving Berlin profile clip
may not be relevant to another
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Maybe not in terms of the type
of article you're pitching, but it is relevant in one respect...
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
it proves to the editor that
you are capable of producing a publishable work
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
What an editor looks for in a
clip...
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
is proof that you are actually
capable or writing well and doing so to someone else's specifications.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Even if you have written on a
very different topic, you did it competantly. And freelancers generally
write on a wide range of topics although
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
they'll usually specialize in
a particular arena.
|
|
reece
|
I haven't written any non
fiction before so could you tell me Mary what does a clip consist of
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Usually it is a xerox copy of
the actual article for nonfiction, reece.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
The editor wants a writing
sample.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you have sold a lot of
articles, then pick one or two that are the closest in content to the
article you're pitching.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
In fiction, you only need to
mention the places where your fiction has been published, you don't need to
include the actual piece.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
There the editor is looking
for name recognition not a writing sample.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Every fiction work is judged
on its own merits
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
The nonfiction editor judges
the query and wants to make the assumption that you will write that piece
competently. Thus the need for a 'writing sample'.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
So. How do you get clips if
you don't have clips?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Generally, in nonfiction, you
either mine your own expertise, a lucky break, or you start at the bottom.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you are an expert in some
area -- you have national titles in running, say, or you're an MD, or you
are the director of a horticultural garden....
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
you can write articles within
your area of expertise and the editor will consider it without clips
because
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
your expertise is a valuable
commodity.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you are lucky, and your
best friend's brother is a national celebrity, you can pitch an interview
with this person and maybe sell
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
it to a national magazine
because that editor WANTS that interview and you can provide it.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Yeah, you have to do it well,
but the editor will probably consider the finished piece with no clips to
support it.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
BUT if you don't have saleable
expertise and you don't have a friend with a national celbrity as a sister,
then you probably will start at the bottom.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
By that I mean you query the
very small presses, even the magazines that pay nothing when they publish
your work.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You are actually getting paid
though, if you think about it. You are getting paid in 'clips'.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Most new freelancers begin to
work their way 'up the ladder'.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
That is, they publish with
those non-payers, then use those clips to sell to small press magazine,
then use those clips to sell
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
to magazines with larger
circulations, working their way up to the large circulation 'glossies'.
|
|
reece
|
can a letter to an editor thats published
be a clip?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
By all means use that if you
have nothing else, especially if it was published in a big metropolitan
daily.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
People who have published on
the LR website should use those clips to start out with.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
It's really not that difficult
to get something published with one of the 'low end' small magazines or ezines.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
And while it's time spent for
no cash gain, it's the foundation that will help you climb the pyramid to
those large circulation, well paying magazines at the top of the heap.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Editors DO use your clips to
decide just where you are in the heirarchy of publishing.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you query a science mag,
say, and your clips include Scientific American and National Geographic,
the editor is going to treat
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
your query VERY seriously.
Clearly you are more than competant in the science writing arena.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
(And the editor probably
already knows your name).
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you query that big science mag
with clips from a couple of online gardening ezines, you won't get a lot of
attention unless the editor REALLY likes your proposal.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
BUT...a really on-target
proposal that knocks the editor's socks off trumps no clips any day. :-)
|
|
onepozy
|
As a new writer should you work
both fiction and non fiction or choose one to work toward publication
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Write what you want to write,
one. They are different universes. Clips from one will not matter to much
to editors in the other field.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Nonfiction is a good paying
day job.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Fiction is not.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
They both require huge amounts
of writing time and work on your part.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Fiction is a bit different
because the story itself is everything in fiction.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
So a brilliant story is a
brilliant story and you can break into the top magazines with a brilliant
story, even if you have never sold anything.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
But 'brilliant story' is a
very subjective judgement. :-)
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Name recognition DOES matter.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you start selling to small
presses, even show up in the no-pay markets, and your stories get noticed,
editors will begin to keep an eye on you
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
and give you a 'hand up' when
they can, by accepting stories.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I would not START with the
small end markets. If you believe that your story is good, start with the
top markets and work your way down.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Not the other way around.
|
|
tory
|
Does one still need clips for
fiction? Editors won't look at a novel from a new writer until it's
complete anyway. Do pubslishers of short fiction want clips or the whole
story?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Yes, you want to use any clip
you have in your cover letter. By that I mean you need to mention where you
have
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
been published, if you have
published fiction before.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
But no, they don't want to see
that story. They want to see the story you are offering them ONLY.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
And you're right. No editor
will purchase an unfinished novel from a novice writer. Some agents may
look at a partial manuscript if the novel seems saleable enough to them.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
And while you don't have to
have clips when you market a novel, if you have been published in short
fiction it can help you
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
sell the novel.
|
|
reece
|
What kinds of magazines publish fiction
stories?And how long should they be for best results?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You need to read the market
list, reece.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You'll find a lot of magazines
that publish fiction and each will have its own guidelines for content and length.
|
|
tory
|
What about the creative
non-fiction shorts? They're true, but read like a short story? Those clips
you would Not use to query say a travel or gardening piece, would you?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Sure you would.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Again, the NF editor is only
concerned about your ability to write professionally.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
A published personal narrative
piece tells 'em you can write professional quality prose.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If your query is professional
and those are your clips, you're fine.
|
|
barbiq
|
What it the adverage word count
for a novel?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Depends on the genre and the
particular publisher, barb. Anywhere from 50,000 - 150,000 words.
|
|
tory
|
Ahh, that brings up my concern.
An editor did their job--editting my piece. But added in adverbs and tom swifty-type
attributions. I'd hate for an editor to judge my writing by that. Best to
just leave it off the list? :-(
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
For sure! If you have had a
piece edited to the point where it no longer represents your writing and
you don' t like it, then don't use it as a clip!
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
That raises my eyebrows, by
the way. Most professional editors don't make that kind of change.
|
|
gonnabe
|
Can't I simply submit a finished
article sans clips?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You can, and to be honest, if
you have no clips, I'd just send in the finished piece as your 'writing
sample'.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
What have you got to lose? The
worst you can get is a rejection.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Some editors will read the
piece to see if it's any good, others will reject it because you didn't
follow the rules. Roll the dice and see what you get.
|
|
tory
|
Yes, I gues I got a newbie
editor, too!
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I'm guessing, so, Tory.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Generally, the reason you do
the query and provide clips is because the editor does NOT want to have to
mess much with your article.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
They have an entire issue to
fill and lay out.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
That editor wants reassurance
that you'll send in something he/she can use with little or no revising.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Which is why it is VERY VERY VERY
important to make sure your query letter is tight, clean and has NO
grammatical errors or typos.
|
|
destiny8
|
Don't want to ruin my chances
with that ed. if I "Roll the
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I doubt you'll 'ruin your
chances' destiny. Editors don't hold grudges for that. They need new
writers all the time.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
But if you get the 'you didn't
follow the rules' rejection, just don't bother to query again until you do
have solid clips to offer.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Editors DO need writers in
order to keep their jobs.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
And in NF especially, they
want a string of 'regulars' they can assign topics to.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
They decide on an issue's
theme WAY in advance and they can't just hope that people send 'em the
right articles.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
They call up their regulars
and ask for specific articles to fill those issues.
|
|
reece
|
How many clips should you submit
if you have many?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Chose your two or three most
appropriate, reece.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Pick clips from similar
articles and use the 'biggest' magazines you've sold to as your clip.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Say you're pitching a garden
piece.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you sold to 'Organic
Gardening' a very large circulation glossy, you'd mention that of course.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
But if all your clips are
pretty small, except for the pesonal narrative you sold to the Atlantic, you'd
mention the best couple of your gardening clips
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
and the Atlantic personal
narrative.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Yeah, it's not a gardening
piece, but you have to write very well to publish in the Atlantic.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
The editor will be impressed
by that and reassured by your published garden pieces.
|
|
gonnabe
|
Are "themes" listed in
the writers guidelines?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Yes, gonnabe, more or less.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Every guideline will tell you
what the editor needs. Often these are very vague, but sometimes they'll
list themes for particular issues.
|
|
barbiq
|
Should you look into local
magazines first?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Always good if you can do it,
barb. That 'local connection' is good and editors like it.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Make sure you keep a file of
your clips.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
If you publish in ezines at first....fertile
ground for acquiring clips...be aware that links are not forever.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
The ezine may remove the
piece, move it, or the ezine itself may go out of business.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Make sure you have a copy of
those articles filed to disk and include the magazine's full name and the
actual date of publication.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
When something comes out in a
print mag, take it to a copy shop and make several copies. File them for
use as clips.
|
|
writingwolfaert
|
how effective is an ezine clip
compared to a print? What would you include first?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
In nonfiction it is all about
circulation.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
That information is available
on the inside cover of the magazine if it's in print.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
An ezine is less identifiable
in terms of number of readers.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
There it's mostly about
reputation.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Most ezines are pretty
negligible in terms of readership.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Wired is one exception. It has
a huge readership.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
And any online version of a
big circulation print mag -- Scientific American, National Geographic, The
Economist -- is gold.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Barb Wire Fence Monthly is not
going to impress editors all that highly. :-)
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
A regular column in a
newspaper is a GREAT clip.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Even a single piece here and
there is good, though.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
IF you can say you're a
regular contributor to a metropolitan paper that's good.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
But ANY clip is good when
you're starting.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Go through the writers markets
and target those little magazines and ezines that don't pay much.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
See if you can write something
for 'em.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Because they don't pay much
the pros don't write for 'em.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
So they're hungry.
|
|
barbiq
|
What makes you a "regular contributer"
to a paper or magazin
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Well, you can interpret that
vague term any way you want, barb. :-)
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I suspect if I was starting
out and I had published three pieces with that newspaper, I'd call myself
that.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I might even do it for two
publications if I was just sure the editor would like my proposal. :-)
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
A bit of creative
interpretation is fine (what's the definition of 'regular' anyway?) as long
as you don't lie.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
The publishing world in NF has
had its nose rubbed hard in lying lately and that is a VERY touchy area
right now.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You get exposed making things
up and you will find it hard to get past that in the future.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
The publishing word is rife
with gossip and names get around.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Editors talk to each other all
the time. The upcoming stars get talked about. And so do the jerks.
|
|
gonnabe
|
Let's call it salesmanship - not
telling lies!
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Salesmanship....creative interpretation...
you know!
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Taht's why you don't tell the
editor that the magazine that published your story didn't pay for it.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You just name the mag.
|
|
reece
|
if you have work printed in a
school or collage paper can you use it as a clip or better to not?
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Not, reece, unless you were
the editor of the Harvard law newsletter or something like that.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Not if you worked on your
basic undergrad newspaper.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
It won't help you and it makes
you sound like a rank amateur.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
You get NO points for being an
amateur from professional editors.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Professional work -- company newsletters,
research papers -- aren't worth a lot, but better than nothing.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Some corporate newsletters are
good, others are put out by employees promoted to that job for other
reasons besides writing competancy.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Better than nothing, but they
tell the editor you haven't published anywhere else. :-)
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
So if you have regular
publishing clips use them first.
|
|
destiny8
|
These NL's go to clients.
Marketing purposes.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Editor doesn't know that. If
you have nothing else, use it, but if you have regular clips, use those.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
NF editors want to know 'can
you do what I want well?"
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
What they want is not what
most company newsletters do. Or scientific papers. Or college newspapers.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
So pay your dues and publish
with those small circulation mags and ezines.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Take your pay in clips at
first and use those to climb up to where you sell to the big circulation mags
and get real money. :-)
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
It's good practice for you,
anyway. The more you write the better you get.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
I'll post the transcripts of
this chat in the usual place: Writing Craft: Forum Transcripts.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Do remember that this
Thursday, I'll be chatting with Valerie Harms on Memoir and how to write
it.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
It should be a great chat if
you're interested in memoir at all.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Drop in here tomorrow,
Wednesday, for our casual get together.
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Same time as today's Forum,
but we just talk about whatever...the weater if nothing else!
|
|
Mary Rosenblum
|
Have a good day, all!
|